Talk:Defeatism
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list
I am not sure if anybody is going to read this, but let me ask anyway. Would it be ok for me to list people that were called defeatist at some point? Or would it be too politicized? --Dejan Cabrilo 17:48, 28 Sep 2004 (UTC)
- Sounds good, but how will they be chosen? Defeatists called such by the media, or from another source?
- Well, I don't know. E.g. Daniil Kharms was sentenced for being a defeatist. Some are calling Sharon a defeatist. I mean, media can call anyone a defeatist, so if we are listing names, let's just use examples of people who were proclaimed to be defeatists with some consequence following. --Dejan Cabrilo 00:48, 24 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- What about Jesus?--Amir E. Aharoni 15:36, 4 January 2006 (UTC)
- Well, I don't know. E.g. Daniil Kharms was sentenced for being a defeatist. Some are calling Sharon a defeatist. I mean, media can call anyone a defeatist, so if we are listing names, let's just use examples of people who were proclaimed to be defeatists with some consequence following. --Dejan Cabrilo 00:48, 24 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- Making an actual list or naming notable people who have been dubbed, categorized, or is "known" for being defeatists, would be extremely political and non-neutral. Jonas Vinther (talk) 17:13, 14 April 2014 (UTC)
Why Nazi generals were accused of 'defeatism' in 1945
I think the article does not do enough to explain why Hitler prosecuted his generals in the final year of World War Two. I tried to add the simple explanation "for pointing out the truth that Nazi Germany was losing to the Allies." however it has been removed by two editors who feel this factual wording is "original research". This basically is accusing me of making up information myself, which is not the case. I am giving those two editors a chance to explain their rationale and motivation here in discussion. KZebegna (talk) 14:35, 18 November 2020 (UTC)
- Original research means something closer to "the statement cannot be sourced" instead of "it is made up". I reverted your edit because it was not supported by a reliable source, and it is not an undisputed fact. If you can verify the truth of your statement (using a reliable source), I will leave you be. Thank you! JJP...MASTER!...MASTER!!! master of puppets, i'm pulling your strings (0-3-5) JJP... master? master? where's the dreams that i've been after (0-3-6-5) 15:26, 18 November 2020 (UTC)
- Of course it can easily be sourced, because it would be much harder to find anywhere a detailed discussion of Hitler's use of "defeatism" giving any other explanation for it. That's why I could not believe anyone would call this "original research". KZebegna (talk) 15:32, 18 November 2020 (UTC)
Laying Flat/Tang ping/Bai lan
Laying Flat/Tang ping/Bai lan outlook on life is a arguably a "right wing" equivalent to revolutionary defeatism.
The Chinese PRC system is Left wing but has some right wing characteristics not unlike Germany in the 30s and 40s. Both having socially Conservative governments who had nationalised lots of industry and private companies allowed to exist had to obey many laws that solely existed for ideological reasons.
From the perspective of Laying Flat/Tang ping/Bai lan When ones effort enriches the government/society and the establishment producing a surplus it is contrary to their interest, in effect the Tang ping ideology is sanctioning China via boycott(to the extent one can do living in china)
And to some extent there are accelerationist overtones so in a way it is like revolutionary defeatism but they are in opposition to a communistic regime.
P.S. the left wing parties(including Conservative in name only/RINO types) in the west tend to want to conserve the establishment order(which is leftist)
While the right wing parties (excluding functionally left wing parties that market themselves as right wing) don't want to conserve the establishment order and want to change policies such as mass migration and speech laws etc.
We should rethink categorising left as liberal and right as conservative.
Given that many left wing groups are authoritarian (not all but a considerable amount) 2A02:C7C:9B90:7B00:F137:12D2:D2B0:3095 (talk) 03:50, 24 July 2024 (UTC)